RFI from Solar inverters! "Not happy Jan ! "

[VK4KX]

Hi and thanks for reading and adding your 2 bobs worth and any help you may be able to offer.

After taking up the Governments offer to have Solar Panels installed at a discounted rate last year we finally got them up in March of this year (2010) and from the moment they were turned on the HF QRN from them has been unbelievable.
I have S9 noise from them at 25KC intervals across the entire HF spectrum with some frequencies being worse than others, and the 10m FM band is not usable at all with the QRN being 40db/9 constant.
This is now combined with the Plasma TV RFI as well, if I caused this much interference I would be shut down in no time.
Has anyone else had this experience?
Do you have a serious fix for it?

If you are considering having Solar installed check if the QRN will be there first or like me be happy to turn the "*&^%$#@" thing off when you want to work HF DX during the day.
My panels are Sharp and the inverter is made by Letronics, now I'm not bagging the manufactures or the installers but! some kind of filtering is needed as these things are FILTHY with RFI!!!!!!!

Oh by the way the installers did it wrong and my bill has been a big fat 000 input to the grid so I'm waiting for them to fix it and hopefully I will get a BIG Fat REBATE when it's put right.

73 all de VK4KAC, VK4KX
Bernie

[VK3GCP]

i dont know about rf noise but my neighbours inverter actually makes an audible whine At around 15khz! It actually hurts! I'll take the handheld around and have a listen later.

[VK2FLAW]

This was one of my concerns about getting a solar system.

I asked in this thread http://vklogger.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=61&t=9465
I only got two responses, as you can see, but there was some interference in the HF bands reported.


I'm still waiting to get mine installed. I signed up just before the feed in tariff got slashed.

[VK5PJ]

Hello to you all,
we have one of the 1.5Kw SUNNYBOY inverters here and it is very quiet. I have asked a number of other ham's who have these SUNNYBOY solar systems inverters and all agree they are HAM friendly, no one has been able to find any emissions from them. My VHF station is quite sensitive and the antennas point across the house roof quite a bit and no birdies or hash here on VHF / UHF. No sign of it on HF either (not on there that much).

Sorry to hear your inverter is such a pain, all I can suggest is to keep a look out for one of the SUNNYBOY inverters and change it over, or see if you can try some form of filtering on the inverter output but I imagine you will need an licensed elec. for that job.

On Peter's 3.5Kw system, it sounds like a beast but you should remember if you start earning too much from it, they may consider it a taxable income I have heard stories about pensioners getting a tax bill for their earnings.

Regards,

[ZL1RS]

Just a short anecdote ...

My ham friend in Europe had inverter noise problems from his neighbour's solar system. The solar system was a small single panel "experimental" sized job but neighbour was not cooperative in finding a solution, so one night the solar panel developed a crack (with the help of a strategically lobbed rock) and a few months later rain water damage destroyed the panel and stopped the inverter from running. No more inverter QRN

73, Bob ZL1RS

[VK2GOM]

The same technique is used by astronomers in the UK to rid of light pollution from '(in)security' lights. Catapults are not classified as prohibited weapons in the UK, and the best ammo is an ice cube since the projectile melts and leaves no trace

Back on the subject of solar inverters, I can imagine a big part of the problem is them being imported in their thousands from China etc. where all the manufacturers are jumping on the profit bandwagon, little is done to meet approvals or RF requirements. Also, purchases from eBay etc. could mean noisy inverters coming into the country.

I wonder if ACMA will have a busy time coming up with their RFI detectors as they proliferate?

73 - Rob VK2GOM /G0MOH

[VK4YOI]

Hi all

A couple of things I think are worthy of note;

ALL grid connect inverters (as well as a bunch of other electrical stuff) are 'items of a prescribed class' in Australia and must be proven compliant to Australian Standards, 'approved', and marked in a particular way prior to being sold in Australia. This requirement is from each state’s electricity legislation or the Federal Regulatory Compliance Mark system (circle tick mark), in my state the Electrical Safety Regulations.

My understanding is all grid connect inverters, (along with every other bit of active electronics) must be EMC compliant prior to being sold in Australia.

It has been my experience, at least from the approval side, if something is identified as not approved action is taken swiftly. There have seen several stories around, both ways regarding the EMC stuff, surely it is still worthy of complaint to the appropriate authority (who I understand is the ACMA). Which leads me to my point, if the regulator doesn’t know how can they take action? (If they don't take action after being told, then that is a whole different story )

73

Marty

[VK2FAK]

Hi All....

has everyone looked at the cost of there new systems....it seems there are some companies out there charging well over what the actual cost should be....has been the talk of "talkback Radio " most of last week...

John

[VK2GOM]

The biggest thing now though is the slashing of the feed-in rate from the original 60c to 20c in NSW. Quite convenient how Kineally (the NSW Premier) got her solar system online on the last possible day to claim the maximum rate before it dropped to 20c

There are rumours around the solar industry now that installation companies will go broke, as less people sign up for solar given the big drop in any financial gain.

On the other hand, it might cause prices for equipment to drop. The markup on solar parts (particularly inverters) is incredible.

73 - Rob VK2GOM / G0MOH

[VK2FLAW]

I can't see how a Gross 20c/KW feed in tariff can be financially viable.
That is less than buying from the grid.

Maybe it would work as a Net FIT, where you only pay the difference from what you produced, to what you used.

I worked out, with the 60c FIT, I would recover investment within 3-4years, then I would start offsetting the bills.

[VK3AUU]

On the subject of interference to AR from consumer devices, does anyone have any experience yet with the new LED lights which are supposed to replace the current lot of incandescant and flouro types, that plug into 240 volt sockets.

David

[VK4KX]

I thought I might follow up on my posting 12 months ago with the latest news.

1. Due to the solar panels having discoloration issues Sharp replaced them all for me at no charge.
2. Due to the Installation Electrician getting it wrong when connecting the panels I missed out on any power that was generated by the panels and the consequent $$ rebate for about 6 months. So, that was fixed, I also received a check, and now the $$ are flowing back in my direction.
3. The RFI from the inverter has been so bad I just turn it off when on the radio and on when not, but I just got off the phone with Latronics and they have agreed to replace the inverter with a modified one that is less RFI prone at no cost to me.
They have a kit they can fit to reduce RFI for "AM radio" reception they call it, so look into that if you have RFI from yours.

Smiles all round here.

73 de VK4KX
Bernie

[VK3DXE]

There seem to be a couple of new solar installations in my area. I'm still to identify the source, but as soon as the sun rises, the noise level on 2m (only band I have any decent sensitivity on) starts to rise noticeably, as it sets, the noise declines.

It's bad enough having to deal with the huge noise generated by the local library's IT infrastructure which kills any chance of EME on moonrise except when the moon is at maximum southerly declination, now there's this added issue. Has anybody had any experience with these kind of issues with ACMA?

[VK1TX]

Hi All,
I about to install a 2kw solar system with 8 panels and a Aurora PVI- 2.0 -outd au INVERTER.
HAS ANYBODY HAD EXPERIENCE WITH THAT INVERTER? ALSO WOULD THE SUNNYBOY INVERTER BE BETTER FOR RFI ?

THE INVERTER WILL BE ON THE OTHERSIDE OF THE HOUSE AWAY FROM THE TOWER /ANTENNAS BUT THE SOLAR PANELS WILL BE ALMOST DIRECTLY UNDERNEATH THE TOWER AND MY STEPPER IR DB18 ANTENNA.

PLEASE ANY INPUT BEFORE ITS TOO LATE !!
THANKS,
TEX VK1TX

[VK4WTN]

hi Tex, I have an aurora 3kw inverter mounted 1.5M from my radios, no noise at all.Most of the EU inverters seem ok just dont go for the cheaper Chinese inverters several hams up here have had RFI problems with them.
regards Wayne VK4WTN

[VK1TX]

HI WAYNE,
THANKS FOR YOUR REPLY.
WELL THAT SOUNDS LIKE GOOD NEWS.
MY ONLY CONCERN NOW WILL BE THE PANELS BEING UNDERNEATH MY TOWER/ANTENNA.

I MAY HAVE TO TRY AND SHIELD THE DC WIRES GOING FROM THE PANELS TO THE INVERTER WHICH WILL BE ABOUT 16 METERS LONG.
MAYBE THE CABLE MAY ACT LIKE AN ANTENNA? HOW FAR ARE YOUR PANELS FROM YOUR INVERTER?
REGARDS,
TEX VK1TX

[VK1JA]

Hi Tex,

I have 2kw worth of panels sitting about 2m away from my HF vertical and I don't get any rfi from them. Same goes for the inverter (SMA SB1700), no noise from it either.

Cheers

Jayson
VK1JA

[VK4WTN]

no worries Tex my panels are only about 7 mtrs from the antenna no noise from them.I only get noise from about every other electrical device in the neighbourhood
cheers Wayne VK4WTN

[VK1TX]

Thanks Wayne and Jayson.
Much appreciated.
TEX VK1TX

[VK4KX]

Well, a couple of years on and all is still good with my Solar installation after both my neighbors and my inverters were fixed by the manufacturer, all they had to do was add the RF filter kits to the inverters and the RFI was gone. HF is almost noise free, except for the Plasma TV's, local QRN, Asian AM & FM QRM etc
So it's important to ask the manufacture or supplier if the Inverter is RFI compliant as they sometimes shortcut and leave out the filtering to save money.


Cheers all.
de VK4KX