The 3.4 GHz amateur band - it's future ?

[VK5ZD]

My vote goes to 3398MHz. Of the different suggestions that have been made, this is the smallest shift from 3400MHz so existing gear is more likely to work without modification or retuning.
Moving to 3580MHz would likely be impossible for any transverter that doesn't have tunable filters.

[VK5KK]

Hi All

Vote # 1 for replicating the current weak signal 3400 MHz band 2 MHz lower to 3398 MHz with a section from 3399.800 to 3399.985 MHz left open for simplex operation all modes. Convenient for EME using a 50 - 100 KHz offset to 3400 MHz and perhaps to transition activity between areas that will still have access to 3400 MHz

Cheers

David VK5KK

[VK3HZ]

Yes, 3398 does look like a better choice.

If you use an FT-817 as an IF radio, you shouldn't need to make any change to your transverter or antenna. For a 70cm IF, you can simply tune down 2 MHz.

For a 2m IF, you will have to open up the Tx on the FT-817 (http://www.pa1ca.nl/my-first-mod/) if you haven't already. This will allow it to transmit on 142 MHz.

Regards,
Dave
VK3HZ

[ZL1TPH]

Hi again,
This may be a better way to ask the question, are there restrictions in place at the moment, anywhere in VK for 3400.1 MHz
If there are no restrictions over the summer DX season well I assume every one will still be on 3400.1
My IF uses 432 = 3400 so I can move down using FT817. But I can't recall how far down the 817 goes
Cheers, Steve

[ZL1TPH]

Just to add which is important, I believe or a better way to put it, our current 3399 to 3400 is about to move up to 3400 to 3401.
And as an added interest they way the microwave bands are set up for narrow band operation. They make all them 1 MHz wide.
Cheers, Steve

[VK5ZD]

This may be a better way to ask the question, are there restrictions in place at the moment, anywhere in VK for 3400.1 MHz

The new LCD says "If the licensee operates an amateur advanced station in the frequency band 3.400 GHz to 3.425 GHz, or the frequency band 3.4925 GHz to 3.5425 GHz, the licensee must not operate the station in an ASMG block specified in Schedule 4A if a PMTS Class B licence authorises the use of a transmitter in that block.".

At the moment, there are no licences issued in the 3.400-3.4250 band (or 3.4925-3.5425), so we're still OK to use 3400.1MHz. Of course, this could change at a moments notice. I'm not sure how often or at what time the licence register is updated, but it would be prudent to check on the day you plan to operate.

The 3.4GHz band licences can be viewed here.

[VK3HZ]

Steve,

Is your move due to a change of the Band Plan or is it due to official removal of your access to that frequency?

The FT-817 will certainly operate fine at 430 MHz for 3398 MHz out of your transverter.

Equally, if you do go to 3400, then our radios should tune up that far (even 2m IF's that use 145 MHz). If the VK operator is in a restricted zone, then split frequency is always possible provided the local QRM is not too bad.

Regards,
Dave
VK3HZ

[VK3HZ]

I notice in the latest WIA Band Plan that 3398 MHz has been included as a Weak Signal operating segment. However, the old 3400 segment is still in there, for use "outside ACMA Restricted Areas".

I'm not sure we want half the country on one frequency and half on another. I think if some are going to be forced to move, then everyone should move. So, the 3400 should be deleted from the Band Plan.

Does that sound reasonable?

Regards,
Dave
VK3HZ

[ZL1TPH]

Hi David VK3HZ
"Is your move due to a change of the Band Plan or is it due to official removal of your access to that frequency?"
Na just petty AR politics behind the scenes where one group wants this and the other group who are new council now wants to please them.
So hence the shift. Means nothing really.
We can move down below 3400 so I'm happy to follow where the VK's reside or decide.
Cheers, Steve
And PS thanks for the URL re FT817 modes to move down the band. I have another 30 Watts TRV that uses a 144 even IF and those was problematic.

[VK4VU]

Hi,

Edited posting follows >

I can understand the logic behind wishing to adopt a small frequency offset (2 MHz) and operate just above 3398 MHz, but I think we also must consider the out-of-band emissions from any future spectrum licensed transmitter.

It's likely that the emission mask for these transmitters will be similar to that described in the ACMA Technical Liaison Group papers which are freely available from the ACMA web-site at http://www.acma.gov.au/~/media/Spectrum ... %20zip.zip. ACMA document MS39 (released April 2015), lays out the steps for the frequency coordination and licensing of PMTS Class B services in the 3.5 GHz band (3400-3425 MHz and 3492.5-3542.5 MHz) http://www.acma.gov.au/~/media/Spectrum ... 0docx.docx

My first reading of TLG documents was that there was a distinctly lower OOB requirement at offsets > 5 MHz, however this is not the general case. If I'm reading things correctly, the general OOB mask closely resembles the 3GPP mask for this class of transmitter. The lower limits only apply only if there was an interference issue with a receiver operated under a spectrum licence on an adjacent channel, so would not apply to amateur radio activities.

The 3GPP mask is such that at 2 MHz offset, the OOB mask is 7.8 dBm/100kHz. At 5 MHz its 3 dBm/100 kHz and at 10 MHz or greater its 2 dBm/1 MHz.


73

Rod VK4VU

[VK2ZRH]

The ACMA will issue PMTS Class B Apparatus licences for NBN wireless access, not spectrum licences (PMTS = Public Mobile Telecommunications Service), in 3.400-3.425 GHz or 3.4925-3.5425 GHz, as noted in the re-made LCD.

Further, I understand that the equipment will be TDD technology, for which cell to client distances are no greater than approx. 10 km.

We need to find out the OOB specification for the TDD technology to be deployed.

I understand the drive to review bandplanning to adapt to the "new realities", especially for weak-signal use, but I must say that wholesale abandonment of 3400-3410 MHz nation-wide is anathema.

Posted as a personal reflection on the current situation.

[VK4VU]

Hi Roger,

Thanks for pointing out that the NBN will be licenced under a PMTS B licence.

I've since realized that my original posting (now edited) was incorrect and that the lower limits (more stringent OOB mask) which I referred to apply to a special case. If I'm reading things correctly, the general OOB mask for both the spectrum licence and apparatus licence (PMTS B) closely resembles the 3GPP mask for this class of transmitter (TD-LTE operated above 1 GHz).

ACMA document MS39 (released April 2015), lays out the steps for the frequency coordination and licensing of PMTS Class B services in the 3.5 GHz band (3400-3425 MHz and 3492.5-3542.5 MHz) http://www.acma.gov.au/~/media/Spectrum ... 0docx.docx

73

Rod VK4VU

[VK2ZRH]

Hi Rod,

Understood.

I'll take a look through the MS39 paper and enwhiten myself.

[VK3HZ]

An update on the Band Plan. The 3400 segment has been deleted so now 3398 MHz looks like the "official" segment.

Regards,
Dave
VK3HZ

[VK4CDI]

The 9cm EME activity weekend is on this weekend. Can I still use 3400.1, or do I have to piss about trying to organise xband QSO's?

Also, how do I find out if I am in the exclusion zone?. The data given by the ACMA means nothing to me, need to convert them to gridsquares.....

Cheers

Phil VK4CDI

[VK2ZRH]

Hi Phil,

Go for it, hammer-and-tongs !

No PMTS Class B licences have been issued, so far as the WIA is aware, as no notification has been received from the ACMA. In addition, I doubt any will be issued between now and 2 September as the ACMA Apparatus licensing system will be shut down from 14 August through 1 September. Visit http://www.wia.org.au/newsevents/news/2 ... /index.php

[VK4GHZ]

Also, how do I find out if I am in the exclusion zone?. The data given by the ACMA means nothing to me, need to convert them to gridsquares.....

Phil, by the same token, grid squares mean nothing to anybody outside the ham radio world.
(Incidentally, you're in NT7L.)

Amateurs will need to become familiar with the HCIS area descriptors.
I've previously posted a link to the ACMA's online converter, but here it is again: http://www.acma.gov.au/applications/hci ... to_kml.asp
You can cut & paste the HCIS references from the LCD and paste them into that converter.

To save others the trouble, below are the KMZ files for each affected state.
Clicking on the KMZ should open them up in Google Earth.
You can then zoom in, yada yada...

[The extension kmz has been deactivated and can no longer be displayed.]

[The extension kmz has been deactivated and can no longer be displayed.]

[The extension kmz has been deactivated and can no longer be displayed.]

[The extension kmz has been deactivated and can no longer be displayed.]

[The extension kmz has been deactivated and can no longer be displayed.]

[VK3QI]

Thanks Adam,

That is a fantastic set of state locators for us to use.

I did not look forward to plugging in all the different HCIS descriptors into the ACMA calculator.

Many thanks!

Cheers

Peter VK3QI

[VK3ALB]

Please don't forget the excellent link that VK5ZD found showing all the current 3.4GHz licenses, who owns them and where they cover.

Above each column it shows two links - The map link shows you the coverage area in a browser window and the KML link obviously helps those with Google Earth installed.

So far ,nothing in the 3400 - 3425 area

[VK4AQF]

My vote goes to 3398. I have synth LO so and my filter will adjust. 3400 - 2 MHz isnt far.

Quentin
VK4AQF