Using Handheld Microphone whilst mobile

[VK2TS]

Do we still have an exemption to use a hand held microphone when operating a radio in a vehicle? If so does anyone know of a link as I would like to print it out to keep in my glove box. Saves arguments with Highway patrol Cow boys

Cheers

[VK3RX]

You need to check your state road traffic rules of course, but in Victoria the regs relating to mobile phone use specifically say:

]mobile phone does not include a CB radio or any other two way radio;

So I keep a copy of the regs in the car, but that said, there are other regs relating to driving without due care etc. so it is best to not get spotted

[VK3ZAZ]

I just asked my local copper mate and he says

CB's are still illegal but you don't get demerit points, just a fine.
The only exemptions are for emergency services in conducting emergency duties.. ambos, ses, coppers,
VIC is considering making GPS fiddling also an offence though many gps wont let you do a thing while you are moving which is a good thing.


The Victorian road rules for mobile phone use differ slightly from the Australian road rules and include added stipulations about using mobile phones for GPS and music functions.
You can not.
On November 25th 2013 the Victorian Government introduced new laws, which extended the ban on first-year probationary drivers using hands-free mobiles to the full three-year probationary period.

[VK3DXE]

I just asked my local copper mate and he says

CB's are still illegal but you don't get demerit points, just a fine.
The only exemptions are for emergency services in conducting emergency duties.. ambos, ses, coppers,
VIC is considering making GPS fiddling also an offence though many gps wont let you do a thing while you are moving which is a good thing.


The Victorian road rules for mobile phone use differ slightly from the Australian road rules and include added stipulations about using mobile phones for GPS and music functions.
You can not.
On November 25th 2013 the Victorian Government introduced new laws, which extended the ban on first-year probationary drivers using hands-free mobiles to the full three-year probationary period.

No, handheld radio communications microphones have a specific exemption in Vic. And this comes from a local copper mate who is a Highway Patrol sergeant. I'll find the relevant legislation and post it up later if somebody doesn't beat me to it.

[VK3HJ]

I drop the microphone anytime I see Police.
Vic Police have recently introduced long range cameras to detect use of mobile phones by drivers. I hope the resolution is sufficient to distinguish between a hand-held phone and a hand-held microphone.
That said, one can usually detect the mobile phoners by the way they drive!
73,
Luke VK3HJ

[VK3RX]

No, handheld radio communications microphones have a specific exemption in Vic.

It would be appreciated Alan, if you can find it.

[VK2OMD]

Firstly, I am not a lawyer... do not rely on the following.

There appears to have been some changes over recent years.

The NSW Road Users Handbook does not mention two way radios, CB, or amateur radios. It does place restrictions on mobile phones, and some classes of licence prohibiting more generally using a "communication device".

So it would seem that they are not specifically or generally prohibited other than for certain licence classes.

IIRC, there was specific mention of two-way radio as excluded from the meaning of "mobile phone" in previous versions of the RUH, words copied from the Australian Road Rules.

The Australian Road Rules are a template for the states, they have no legal force AFAIK. However, they do contain a qualification of a mobile phone "mobile phone does not include a CB radio or any other two-way radio" and that might be useful in the NSW context that not only is operation of two-way radios not prohibited for most licence classes in the RUG, but the ARR on which state road rules are modelled gives a clear indication that two-way radios are not mobile phones and so not captured by those provisions.

Now I am sure a lawyer for NSW would make issue that the NSW RUH being silent on this matter has some significance. Though a counter argument was that if NSW intended to prohibit use of two way radios, they should not have been silent but been explicity on the matter.

So much for clarity in the law!

Owen

[VK2CSW]

For NSW, see Section 4 below (highlighted)
http://www.legislation.nsw.gov.au/fragv ... N?tocnav=y:

Road Rules 2008
Current version for 21 March 2014 to date (accessed 4 May 2014 at 16:44)
Part 18 Division 1 Rule 300

300 Use of mobile phones by drivers (except holders of learner or provisional P1 licences)

(1) The driver of a vehicle must not use a mobile phone while the vehicle is moving, or is stationary but not parked, unless:
(a) the phone is being used to make or receive a phone call (other than a text message, video message, email or similar communication) or to perform an audio playing function and the body of the phone:
(i) is secured in a mounting affixed to the vehicle while being so used, or
(ii) is not secured in a mounting affixed to the vehicle and is not being held by the driver, and the use of the phone does not require the driver, at any time while using it, to press any thing on the body of the phone or to otherwise manipulate any part of the body of the phone, or
(b) the phone is functioning as a visual display unit that is being used as a driver’s aid and the phone is secured in a mounting affixed to the vehicle, or
(c) the vehicle is an emergency vehicle or a police vehicle, or
(d) the driver is exempt from this rule under another law of this jurisdiction.
Maximum penalty: 20 penalty units.

Note 1. Emergency vehicle, park and police vehicle are defined in the Dictionary.
Note 2. See rule 299 (2) for examples of driver’s aids.
Note 3. Subrule (1) is not uniform with the corresponding subrule in rule 300 of the Australian Road Rules. Different rules may apply in other Australian jurisdictions.
(2) For the purposes of this rule, a mobile phone is secured in a mounting affixed to the vehicle only if:
(a) the mounting is commercially designed and manufactured for that purpose, and
(b) the mobile phone is secured in the mounting, and the mounting is affixed to the vehicle, in the manner intended by the manufacturer.
(3) For the purposes of this rule, a driver does not use a phone to receive a text message, video message, email or similar communication if:
(a) the communication is received automatically by the phone, and
(b) on and after receipt, the communication itself (rather than any indication that the communication has been received) does not become automatically visible on the screen of the phone.
(3–1) This rule does not apply to the driver of a vehicle who is the holder of a learner licence or a provisional P1 licence.
Note 1. Provisional P1 licence is defined in the Dictionary and learner licence is defined in the Act.
Note 2. Rule 300–1 provides for the use of mobile phones by drivers who are holders of learner licences or provisional P1 licences.
Note 3. This subrule is an additional NSW subrule. There is no corresponding subrule in rule 300 of the Australian Road Rules.
(4) In this rule:
affixed to, in relation to a vehicle, includes forming part of the vehicle.

body, in relation to a mobile phone, means the part of the phone that contains the majority of the phone’s mechanisms.

held includes held by, or resting on, any part of the driver’s body, but does not include held in a pocket of the driver’s clothing or in a pouch worn by the driver.

mobile phone does not include a CB radio or any other two-way radio.

use, in relation to a mobile phone, includes any of the following actions by a driver:

(a) holding the body of the phone in her or his hand (whether or not engaged in a phone call), except while in the process of giving the body of the phone to a passenger in the vehicle,
(b) entering or placing, other than by the use of voice, anything into the phone, or sending or looking at anything that is in the phone,
(c) turning the phone on or off,
(d) operating any other function of the phone.


Google is your Friend...

[VK3MIX]

Those in Victoria can follow these instructions to the Road Safety Road Rules 2009 (Rule 300, Part 4)... http://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/Home/Abo ... cRoads.htm

[VK2OMD]

For NSW, see Section 4 below (highlighted)
http://www.legislation.nsw.gov.au/fragv ... N?tocnav=y:

Road Rules 2008
Current version for 21 March 2014 to date (accessed 4 May 2014 at 16:44)
Part 18 Division 1 Rule 300

...
Google is your Friend...

I used Google to find the Road User's Handbook dated August 2013.

I think your quote is of the law itself, and it would seem that in compiling the Road User Handbook, they have chosen to omit the qualification of mobile phones not including two way radios.

So, the law itself looks clearer than the Handbook. I guess the Hanbook is a job creation project, duplication (almost) paid for by taxpayers, and not as clear in this case.

Anyway, good work Colin.

Owen

PS: I did check the ACT rules since I go there from time to time, and it does make it clear that "mobile phone" does not include two way radio.

[VK2CSW]

Hi Owen,

I took a punt that under the Act the term "two-way radio" wouldn't crop up much so framed my search thus.

Exactly 1 instance was found (phew).

I hope it is of use to the OP.

[VK3DXE]

Vic Legislation is here: http://www.legislation.vic.gov.au/domin ... 4sr004.pdf

Scroll down to "Rule 300" and you'll find it says pretty much the same thing.

I've sat alongside police vehicles, including highway Patrol, on a number of occasions while on the mobile radio and as soon as they see the curly cord, they pay no further attention.

I'm actually surprised that some smart a*** hasn't come out with a curly cord attachment for phones to slip past the cursory glance of the Constabulary.

[VK6ADF]

I am guessing but perhaps they could possibly book someone using a two-way for failing to drive with due care and attention or careless driving if they wanted to. I am sure a reason could be found

I must admit I always drop the mike if a Police person or vehicle is spotted. Over here they recently had plain motor bikes with helmet mounted camera's recording phone users secretly and prosecuting, and caught a lot. Not actually heard of any two-way users being punished yet.

There are commercial operations that rely on two way radio's being used. Two I can think of straight away that are not an emergency vehicle as such but pilot vehicles escorting large loads use the two ways constantly while driving, so do Taxi's (and fiddle with their CAD system while driving) so I can't see a blanket ban on two ways being too popular.

[VK5IR]

Vic Police have recently introduced long range cameras to detect use of mobile phones by drivers.

Do you really believe this garbage?

[VK5TX]

It was on the news in NSW

[ZL3MF]

Here are the rules in New Zealand...

1. Ban on the use of hand-held mobile phones while driving

What will be the extent of the proposed ban?

The Rule has been amended to:
ban the use of hand-held mobile phones and other telecommunications devices, such as Blackberry devices and Personal Digital Assistants (PDAs), while driving (including using these devices to text or email);
exempt the use of hands-free mobile phones and two-way radios; and
allow genuine emergency calls to be made where it is impracticable to pull over to make a call.

How is a mobile phone defined in the Rule?

In the amendment Rule a 'mobile phone' is defined as follows:
Includes a portable electronic device whose functions include being a telephone
Does not include a CB radio
Does not include any other kind of two-way radio
Does not include an earpiece or mouthpiece that is connected, physically or otherwise, to a mobile phone to allow a driver to use the phone without holding or manipulating it.

http://www.nzta.govt.nz/resources/rules ... -qa.html#1

Cheers

Mike ZL3MF

[VK2TS]

Thanks Guys your input and advice is appreciated.

Cheers

[VK3RX]

Vic Police have recently introduced long range cameras to detect use of mobile phones by drivers.

Do you really believe this garbage?

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/polic ... 36o7f.html

[VK3ZAZ]

No, handheld radio communications microphones have a specific exemption in Vic. And this comes from a local copper mate who is a Highway Patrol sergeant. I'll find the relevant legislation and post it up later if somebody doesn't beat me to it.

I just spoke to Dennis Dawson TMU HAMILTON

He said "tell the idiot who told you that come though my town and I catch you, you will be fined $185.00 on the spot, or if he chooses he can come to court and argue with the magistrate about his rights to use a radio while driving at 100km/h"


EMERGENCY EXEMPTIONS APPLY ONLY TO AMBOS, SES, POLICE, CFA, DNRE, PARAMEDICS, VICROADS, ECV otherwise its concentrate and both hands on the wheel.

He said technically Taxi Drivers should not but they don't enforce it they leave it up to VIC Roads and Damien at Vicroads told me today they will BOOK TRUCK DRIVERS for using CB radio especially if they pervert the course of justice "Flash for Cash at the town bridge"" but that's a different matter.

he said if hams used radio to tell about cameras and they used their callsigns or a complaint was made or they were identified as carrying out that sort of practice, they could get booked also.

Dawson said it is as much about Concentrating on driving.

If you are stupid enough to yack on radio and have a crash you willk be charged with careless driving if you tell them what you were doing.

[VK2KRR]

I just spoke to Dennis Dawson TMU HAMILTON

Sounds like he is taking the law into his own hands, you probably need to show him the legislation Steve so he can get it right.