"Out of District" Callsign use

[VK2LK]

Hi All,

Due to the recent events surrounding a certain prolific HAM's website having to close down due to a forced callsign change, I think it is time that ACMA, in conjunction with WIA overhauled the callsign system to bring it in line with more modern (best) practices. In the US and NZ (and possibly in other countries too, I am yet to confirm), an amateur operator is permitted to keep their home callsign in the even they move regions (eg, a ZL2 station moving to region ZL4). This would be advantageous for specific HAMs that have set up websites, written articles, and other material.

To use an example, if someone that produces a ton of great information and enthusiasm for the hobby (e.g. VK3YE or VK1OD) we're to move, it would be of great benefit for everyone if they could retain their identity.

Of course, new licensees would be required to have a callsign issued that relates to their geographical location (So someone applying for a license in NSW will get a VK2 call) But if a HAM is required to move interstate they could retain their existing callsign.

The FCC don't have a problem with it (from wikipedia:-)

In the last few decades the FCC has discarded the requirement that a station be located in the corresponding numerical district. Whereas at one time the callsign W1xxx would have been solid identification that the station was in New England (district 1), that is no longer the case, and W1xxx may be located anywhere in the USA. Even particularly distinctive calls such as KH6xxx which used to be exclusively in Hawaii, may be assigned to license holders on the US mainland. However, those licensees with KH6, KL7, KP4, etc., call signs must have been living in Hawaii, Alaska or Puerto Rico when they received those call signs.

If NZ and USA can do this, why can't we? I would like to have this changed and I think with the support of the community, and the WIA, along with supporting evidence as to why its a good thing (citing reasons from how the other countries got it past their regulatory bodies) we can get this changed.

The second thing I believe it is time we had changed is for HAMs to get access to single letter callsigns. Last time I checked, the VK2A - VK2Z range had one scientific license assigned to it (I think it was a TAFE in Newcastle) who in reality won't care at all if their callsign changes to something else. These "Vanity calls" could then be put to better uses....

[VK4TI]

Hi All,

Due to the recent events surrounding a certain prolific HAM's website having to close down due to a forced callsign change, I think it is time that ACMA, in conjunction with WIA overhauled the callsign system to bring it in line with more modern (best) practices. In the US and NZ (and possibly in other countries too, I am yet to confirm), an amateur operator is permitted to keep their home callsign in the even they move regions (eg, a ZL2 station moving to region ZL4). This would be advantageous for specific HAMs that have set up websites, written articles, and other material.

To use an example, if someone that produces a ton of great information and enthusiasm for the hobby (e.g. VK3YE or VK1OD) we're to move, it would be of great benefit for everyone if they could retain their identity.

Of course, new licensees would be required to have a callsign issued that relates to their geographical location (So someone applying for a license in NSW will get a VK2 call) But if a HAM is required to move interstate they could retain their existing callsign.

The FCC don't have a problem with it (from wikipedia:-)

In the last few decades the FCC has discarded the requirement that a station be located in the corresponding numerical district. Whereas at one time the callsign W1xxx would have been solid identification that the station was in New England (district 1), that is no longer the case, and W1xxx may be located anywhere in the USA. Even particularly distinctive calls such as KH6xxx which used to be exclusively in Hawaii, may be assigned to license holders on the US mainland. However, those licensees with KH6, KL7, KP4, etc., call signs must have been living in Hawaii, Alaska or Puerto Rico when they received those call signs.

If NZ and USA can do this, why can't we? I would like to have this changed and I think with the support of the community, and the WIA, along with supporting evidence as to why its a good thing (citing reasons from how the other countries got it past their regulatory bodies) we can get this changed.

The second thing I believe it is time we had changed is for HAMs to get access to single letter callsigns. Last time I checked, the VK2A - VK2Z range had one scientific license assigned to it (I think it was a TAFE in Newcastle) who in reality won't care at all if their callsign changes to something else. These "Vanity calls" could then be put to better uses....

Confusing as hell with some countries now , why would you want to make it even more so ?

[VK2LK]

I believe I addressed the benefits above.

[VK4TI]

I believe I addressed the benefits above.

Any perception you have re benefits is outweighed by the difficulties imho . Pointless debate in the long rub.

[VK3ZAZ]

I believe I addressed the benefits above.

More KL7s in Lower 48 than in KL7

Calla W8 he is in W4

Call a W4 he was in KH6


There s a VK's from all over swanning around VK4 dropping the /4 for /P



where does it end



I was VK3ZAZ portable all over VK east coast in 1,2,3,5 from 1968-1976

And many military guys did same thing with C calls

I was VK5CGZ that became at my choice VK3CGZ

Some of the ZLs are all over not in 1,2,3, or 4

I haven't heard of anyone being denied callsigns
VK#AA is held all over by expats

What are you complaining about that you can not do?

[VK2XSO]

It seems pretty simple to me. By default you're issued a callsign as per the current arrangement.
If you move house intrastate it should be no different to interstate.
Take your federal callsign with you from one colony to another.

Nothing difficult about it. Continue to issue callsigns as per normal. Don't enforce the requirement, exactly like the current situation !

[VK4TS]

Can someone please point me to the actual legislation that says you have to change callsign ? The only thing I can find is that you must notify ACMA of change of address within four months..

"Portable operation of an amateur station
The licensee must not operate an amateur station at a location not mentioned in the licence for a continuous period of:
(a) if the station is an amateur beacon station or an amateur repeater station — more than 7 days; and
(b) in any other case — more than 4 months.
Note If the licensee intends to operate an amateur station at a location not mentioned in the licence for a continuous period longer than the relevant period mentioned in section 10, the licensee should ask the ACMA to change the location mentioned in the licence to the new location by varying the licence under section 111 of the Act."

[VK2TS]

Can someone please point me to the actual legislation that says you have to change callsign ? The only thing I can find is that you must notify ACMA of change of address within four months..

"Portable operation of an amateur station
The licensee must not operate an amateur station at a location not mentioned in the licence for a continuous period of:
(a) if the station is an amateur beacon station or an amateur repeater station — more than 7 days; and
(b) in any other case — more than 4 months.
Note If the licensee intends to operate an amateur station at a location not mentioned in the licence for a continuous period longer than the relevant period mentioned in section 10, the licensee should ask the ACMA to change the location mentioned in the licence to the new location by varying the licence under section 111 of the Act."

Excellent point Trent!

Cheers

[VK2LK]

Unfortunately certain elements in the ACMA would disagree and have just forced one HAM to change his call:-

viewtopic.php?f=45&t=11997&hilit=VK1OD

[VK2LK]

What are you complaining about that you can not do?

http://vk1od.net/index.htm

Read that.

[VK3ZAZ]

Still don't get it

I had VK3SIX

My website is still VK3SIX

so is my Personalised number plate

I am not VK3SIX any more

But I have not lost my identity.

If you had VK1OD and continued to pay for it you could keep it

Like VK9LG VK9LI, VK0HI, VK0MI, VK9XI,
VK9AA VK8AA VK4AA VK3AA VK2AA VK1AA
VK5AA?

I am also N6DOT which I own
JE6NCH
H40OT
H44OT
YJ8OT
VK3OT
and VK3ZAZ which I owned from 1968-1976
and bought back in 2010
I swapped KL7SIX for KG6SIX but could buy back AL7QZ and 7J1BAX.

all it takes is money

[VK2LK]

Ok, so hypothetically, I can permanently move QTH to, say VK5, and operate as VK2LK portable 5 for as long as I want with no problems from the ACMA?

If thats the case, why has Owen been forced to change callsign?

[VK4TS]

Matt.... I have never seen the legislation that says the callsign MUST change..

I have been wrong before and would love to see the actual legislation that says it must be done; nobody seems to be able to produce it... from recollection this requirement was dropped in 1999...

[VK2LK]

Hi Trent,

Understood, however It would be fantastic if the ACMA were on the same page then:-

(Notice that VK1OD is now VK2OMD? That was forced upon him by a specific individual from the ACMA)

From The other thread

Does it? Just curious, but where does it say you have to get a new callsign?
Once upon a time, yes, but this appears to be a rule/convention that has quietly disappeared.

Not according to the ACMA's Daniel Walker who spoke to me a couple of days ago.

The subject is discussed in the US context at http://www.eham.net/articles/31154 . Clearly there is a range of opinions.

In my case, I was advised that a single complaint was received from a member of the public, and that the ACMA, being complaint driven, must act on that complaint. Of course, the complainent's identity is protected under privacy laws.

I don't know how the complainent sleeps at night when he cant tell what part of New Zealand a ham is operating in, ZL abandoned the regional significance of call sign prefixes like some other large advanced English speaking countries (UK, US).

The reasons for preserving the state significance of call signs can only be to satisfy the train-spotters among us, but I concede that is a growing activity as the technology becomes too much for most hams. On the other hand, it drives administration costs and breaks an identity link that, like it or not, exists between a person and well known callsign (eg how often to you see an article in AR or QST that doesn't prominently show the author's call sign).

Owen

[Apologies: this is a sidetrack, and Adam may want to move the stuff into its own thread.]

[VK4TS]

Matt,

Continually going back to that thread is not going to make it wrong or right -

Can we ask someone else to show us the actual piece of regulation ?

EDIT ADD "PLEASE" - I forgot to say please

[VK2HRX]

Trent,

Matt has directed you to a post where you can see the ACMA officer who made this determination. His email will be firstname.lastname@acma.gov.au

Why dont you contact Daniel directly and request the details you seek?

[VK4TS]

Simple Compton,

The legislation should have been posted here immediately if it was available - the fact that no one has done so shows -

either

we are all ignorant to the legislation

or

It does not exist

[VK2JH]

"I pays me money and keeps me callsign" .... simple as that, with the proper change of address notification, of course.

John
VK2JH & VK4JHC
Mount Hallen Qld 4312

[VK2AAH]

What I can't work out in this is what was the complaint?

Daniel isn't a bad bloke... I've dealt with him before. But what could using a VK1 callsign in VK2 do to generate a complaint? Was the callsign causing the complainant interference? Was the issue Owen was defrauding the government by doing it? No to that one... So on what basis was there a complaint? It take the word frivolous to a whole new level... I've been a big supporter of the work ACMA does but this one leaves me feeling that precious investigation and enforcement hours were spent chasing a pathetically petty matter...

Cheers

Richard
VK2AAH

[VK2GOM]

I think Owen summed it up. The fact a single complaint was received, in this day and age there are customer charters etc. and processes to follow up these complaints. We HAVE to pander to them, no matter how ridiculous the complaint.

I have heard of TV shows pulled off air as the result of a single complaint. The simple solution is there's always the TV off switch or Channel up/down...

And I hear that the nationwide stock of Aldi's 'AUSTRALIA: Est. 1788' t-shirts from the weekend that THREE people assumed were 'offensive' (?) and complained through the consumer channels, led to them being removed from sale. Again, these three weren't forced to buy them.

It's all just a sad indictment of the namby pamby world we now live in.

Surely VK2OMD.net can return? I can guarantee the URL is available

73 - Rob VK2GOM / GW0MOH